American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Tue Feb 16, 2010 1:56 pm

Image
Lola designs.

Lola vs Swift would be okay.
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MiÑardi » Sun Feb 21, 2010 8:21 am

The Lola is growing on me.

In other news, Sato has officially joined the series for 2010!
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby Travis Daye » Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:50 am

The Lola looks the most conventional, but still...

Diffusers underneath the sidepods? WTF?

Makes you wonder whether these designs have actually been tested in a wind tunnel or if they're just boyhood fantasies...
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby Kai-Star » Sun Feb 21, 2010 5:00 pm

Travis Daye wrote:Makes you wonder whether these designs have actually been tested in a wind tunnel or if they're just boyhood fantasies...


Yeah my thoughts too. How much corner speed will that torpedo design have???
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:23 pm

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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby Brains » Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:28 pm

Or...
jacquesvilleneuve_indycar_longbeach_1995.jpg
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MiÑardi » Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:09 pm

I do like that Swift! I just wonder when the series will be ready to go ahead with a new car. Did I hear they were keeping the Dallara for another year because it would be cheaper?
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Wed Apr 07, 2010 5:56 pm

MiÑardi wrote:I do like that Swift! I just wonder when the series will be ready to go ahead with a new car. Did I hear they were keeping the Dallara for another year because it would be cheaper?

I've heard rumours that that is the case, but I don't know if it's official. Wouldn't surprise me though. Things are still pretty dire financially.

But they need new cars, and the sooner the better. And more than one chassis would actually make things technically interesting. AOW is still on life support in many ways.
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby Kai-Star » Wed Apr 07, 2010 8:48 pm

MonteCristo wrote:AOW is still on life support in many ways.


That's a shame because quite frankly NASCAR is %#*&!
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Fri May 28, 2010 7:21 pm

IndyCar at a 'watershed moment'

By Simon Strang and Matt Beer Friday, May 28th 2010, 17:11 GMT

Leading team owners Roger Penske and Chip Ganassi believe the IndyCar Series is growing in strength, but is at a potentially decisive moment in its history as it prepares to choose its next generation rules package.

After falling a long way behind NASCAR in terms of profile and exposure during the IndyCar/Champ Car split, American single-seater racing has regained a little momentum this year, with larger fields in the IndyCar Series, the arrival of a proactive title sponsor in Izod, and a positive response to new series boss Randy Bernard's first few months in charge.

Ganassi believes the future of the championship currently looks brighter than it has for some time.

"There are dormant things but this is like it's a step thing, it's one step at a time," he said. "I think we're making steps, management's in place to make those steps and given the edict to do that and I think it's moving along at the right pace."

Five car builders have put forward concepts for the 2012 chassis, and a committee of experts has been formed to debate the rules package. Penske thinks that the possibility of returning to multiple engine and chassis suppliers after several years of a Dallara-Honda spec formula could be a very good thing for IndyCar.

"I think the fact that the committee is looking today at an engine formula that will hopefully attract multiple suppliers, will be good for the sport," he said.

"We've got to be sure that the specifications on whatever it is are realistic because we can't get into all fancy metals and things and I think that's got to be important or we get the cost out of sight on the chassis side.

"If there's the ability to have one chassis supplier, I'd like to see multiple. But again, we've got to be sure that the price of the race vehicles us at a level that everybody can afford them. I think that's got to be the ceiling. If someone wants to buy one and subsidise it, fine, but it costs the same whether Chip buys it or I buy it or someone wants to get in the series."

Penske said he was enthusiastic about the possibility of incorporating a radical concept like the DeltaWing chassis proposal and the 'world engine' idea being debated across international motorsport at present.

"I think that change is always good. It's going to shake up the field. One thing we want to do is look at cost," he said.

"I've followed the DeltaWing project from the beginning; I'm a supporter. I want to see a car built, and we've got to get the funding to build that car, get it on the racetrack, let people see it.

"There's an interest on four-cylinder versus six-cylinder engines. They want to have potentially a formula where you could have one or the other, which I think is good. There's a lot of interest internationally on four-cylinder engines which will be run in Formula 1 and DTM and rallying and maybe we have to have a derivative of that over there.

"I think this is all good. Under the current process we're taking our time, everybody can be heard, we're just not making a bunch of rules in the back room because at the end of the day the car owners are the ones who have to pay for it. If we're going to make a change, let's make one that shows the fans we have something different and we have something economically and commercially that's beneficial for the teams. So to me I'm all in favour of it."

He believes it is crucial that the right decision is made as IndyCar is currently regaining momentum in spite of the difficult economic environment.

"I think this is a watershed time for us," Penske said. "The fact we have so many cars in this field in a time when the economy and the world is where it is, I think shows that there's some strength here."

Yay.

And then... nay. Deltawing :down:
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby Max2147 » Sat May 29, 2010 9:43 am

ESPN's Ed Hinton wrote a 4-part series on The Split recently. I certainly don't agree with everything he says, but he provides a lot of insight into the origins and early days of what happened.

http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/columns/s ... id=5195237
http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/columns/s ... id=5195825
http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/columns/s ... id=5217415
http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/columns/s ... id=5217884

That all in the past, I've been very pleasantly surprised with Randy Bernard. He knows his limitations (knowing nothing about racing before he arrived), and as a result he's actually listening to what smart people tell him. If Tony George had done that, we wouldn't be in this situation right now. And heck, if the guy can take bull riding to huge heights, imagine what he can do for Indycar!

The most important part? Robin Miller is a fan.

Here's Hinton's take (because I couldn't find Miller's column on Speed's godawful site): http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/racing/in ... id=5229000

I have to say that despite everything that's gone wrong, things are actually starting to look up for Indycar (one of Bernard's best moves: banishing the IRL name). A competent CEO, a new car/engine package for next year, and a title sponsor that's actually committed to promoting the series - all new within the last year. It's still baby steps, but at least they're in the right direction. After 14 years, I think American open-wheel might have finally bottomed out and gotten back on the upswing.
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby Brains » Sun May 30, 2010 8:39 am

The article is depressing. So very depressing.

Oh well. Yay. It's mindy day!
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Sun May 30, 2010 9:27 am

Brains wrote:The article is depressing. So very depressing.

That it is.

I remember so much of it, and it still makes me angry to this day. I will never, ever forgive Tony George.

When I found out that his family, finally, dumped him, a few years ago I would have cried tears of joy. But when it finally happened, after all that occurred, I just shook my head. There was nothing left to fight for anymore.

Go Will.
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Sat Jun 05, 2010 6:24 pm

Apparently they're aiming to make a chassis announcement by the end of the month.

God I hope they go with multiple...
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby Travis Daye » Sat Jun 05, 2010 7:01 pm

I still fail to see how the Deltawing car could ever go around a corner, even on four wheels. And I wonder what would happen to such a low-drag, low-weight, low-downforce car in the event of a crash.

All designs seem to be backed by solid manufacturers, and the variety of approaches is staggering, so I too hope that teams will be able to choose between different chassis. That might bring some of the old CART spirit back.
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Wed Jun 30, 2010 3:51 pm

Apparently the "decision" was made yesterday (the 30th).

The "announcement" will be July 14.
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby Max2147 » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:11 pm

Any reliable word on what car they chose?
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Wed Jun 30, 2010 11:03 pm

Miller said in his latest Mailbag article:
RM: I think you are going to like the new chassis options, let's leave it at that

Options? Plural? More than one? Multiple chassis?

Hopefully that's what he means anyway.
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby the_full_monty » Thu Jul 01, 2010 7:45 pm

If they go multiple chassis and ignore that Deltawing farce, coupled with the new engine regs, I'll be gleeful enough to raise the desk.

Spec-nonsense and/or Deltawing shenanigans and AOWR is dead to me.
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Thu Jul 01, 2010 9:51 pm

the_full_monty wrote:If they go multiple chassis and ignore that Deltawing farce, coupled with the new engine regs, I'll be gleeful enough to raise the desk.

Spec-nonsense and/or Deltawing shenanigans and AOWR is dead to me.

Indeed. I've given Mindycar half a chance this year after the Idiot Grandson left, and I've followed half the races as a result.

Randy Bernard, the new head, seems to listen to the fans and get shit done, so I live in hope of proper regulations returning. But if the economics aren't there, and they can't have multiple chassis... I guess that's all than can do. But if that happens, I'll still only have a passing interest. Give them two+ chassis, whatever engine manufacturers turn up on the cheap, a 12-13-14 row grid, and I'll be back on the bandwagon.

Miller also said that the new chassis will be much cheaper than the Dallara. If so, hopefully it'll attract extra teams. There are plenty of cars out there at the moment, but it kinda sucks if half the damn field are Lesser Andretti entries.

A bad news update on the chassis though:
IndyCar's New Chassis To Be Revealed July 14
Published Jul 1, 2010

INDIANAPOLIS — With engine rules already in place, the IRL IndyCar Series says it will announce plans at a media event on July 14 for its 2012 racing car.

Unlike the engine formula, which will be open to multiple configurations in the hope of attracting a variety of manufacturers as participants, the committee charged with setting up the new rules is believed to be considering a single winner from five manufacturers that have submitted bids to be the car supplier.

Bidders include the current chassis supplier, Dallara, along with Lola, Swift, BAT Engineering and DeltaWing. The DeltaWing proposal represents a radical departure from the design that has evolved for open-wheel single-seat racing cars, with the image of a modern military jet evoked by its vertical stabilizers and narrow front axle design.

Other prototypes are more conventional in appearance.

Presentations from the five bidders have been heard by the ICONIC — Innovative, Competitive, Open-Wheel, New, Industry-Relevant, Cost-Effective — Advisory Committee. Retired Air Force General William R. Looney III heads the committee.

A decision "is imminent," said Randy Bernard, IndyCar chief executive officer. "We look forward to unveiling our plans to our teams, drivers, partners, fans and the media during a special event on July 14."

The engine formula, announced June 3, will accommodate four- or six-cylinder engines with displacements as large as 2.4 liters — a marked change from the spec 3.5-liter V8 that Honda now supplies to all competitors in the series.

With the new engine rule, IndyCar took a turn away from the pattern still embraced by Formula 1 and NASCAR, in which engines are supplied by different manufacturers but are restricted to an all-but-identical size and configuration.

Inside Line says: The committee made a good move by opening up the engine options, but it appears IndyCar will follow the herd with cookie-cutter racing cars. — David Green, Correspondent

Sad/angry panda :(.
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby the_full_monty » Fri Jul 02, 2010 12:06 pm

Thing is, as F1 (and presumably Indycar) seem to be able to handle artificial engine parity rules ok, then surely they can ensure no development war breaks out with the chassis either, to make sure that the series can handle two/three designs without one being dominant.

It's a bit naff to restrict designers too heavily, but that would do for a few years, then as/when/if the financial situation picks up, you can open it up a bit more.
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MiÑardi » Fri Jul 02, 2010 1:11 pm

I don't mind spec engines too much. Particularly for the oval races anyway. I really hope there are a good choice of chassis though.

I actually wouldn't care if the Delta Wing was one of them! As long as there were other options and we soon see how dumb it looks on the track when it can't get around the hairpin at Long Beach. :P
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Tue Jul 13, 2010 11:33 pm

Today is the day...

All sorts of rumours and BS flying around.

Will it be spec car?

Will it be a spec tub with builders allowed to do what they want with the rest?

Will it be a couple of the cars put forward?

Will it be the, hahahaha, Delta Wing?

Will it be the end? :(
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby Travis Daye » Wed Jul 14, 2010 4:28 am

Will it fly?
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Re: American Open Wheel War ends. We all ask ourselves: Why?

Postby MonteCristo » Wed Jul 14, 2010 8:32 am

The mood among the Indy die-hards seems bleak. A lot are expecting the worst, lol.
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